Venom #3, #5, and the Black Hole that is Discussing Them

great article J and a debate that needs to be had. I didn't read the comic but if it IS a Knull Avatar, that gets an asterisk. Like the first appearance of Daimon Hellstrom, and Jane Foster as Thor, Erick the Red in Avengers, these things can get confusing, must factor in the story and comic market.

We are at the point in time now, 2021, where these comic writers know the impact of first appearances and use this to sell comics and keep folks buying. Knull is a HUGE character who could start a platform for a new series of books and storylines.

I feel like Marvel made the 3rd printing with him on the cover, on purpose. Comic Book Shops need love from Marvel and this is how they do it.

the community does not consider comic store exclusive covers as “canon” in a character’s 1st appearance. Therefore the first cover appearance must come direct from the publisher i.e. Marvel. Frankie’s Comics does not own the rights to Knull nor are they the creators. Venom #4 2nd print is a more legitimate argument for collecting. Venom #3 3rd print is a combo of Knull on the cover and Knull’s first comic appearance but I agree it’s over priced and overhyped.

• I'd disagree. "The community" doesn't agree on this book. If they did, the Frankie's comics version wouldn't be argued as the first Knull Cover app, but it is. These are muddied waters and I think we both have about as much right to speak for the entire comic community as the next person, which is none. I can agree, however, that the book is overhyped and have seen a marked drop since I wrote that article two months ago when the FMV was around $750. It's quite a bit lower now for a variety of reasons, but I think deflated hype contributed.
  
  J

Hi Jake,

I appreciate the conversation and the article. However, to clarify my position and probably of many others, I never claimed that Venom 3 Third Print was Knull's first cover. I claimed it was a version of his first appearance with him on the cover.

I personally own many copies of Venom 3 First and Third Prints. More Firsts than Thirds, but I love them both.

As far as the crystal ball goes, my advice to people is to diversify. Buy both. If you can't afford both, buy the one you like.

Thanks for article. I hope you have a nice day.

• Thanks for the comment, Jared.
  
  I wasn't saying you were claiming it was Knull's first cover. I'm saying plenty of other people are saying that. If you search eBay or other auction sites for first Knull cover, you will see #3 3rd print often labeled as such. The mistake is saying any of these comics are the definitive 1st Knull Cover because there's lots of arguments for and against. Like I've stated before, I do not see later printings as genuine "firsts" of anything. This article is to clarify that point.
  
  J

Believe me. There are many of us out there who are railing against the later printings especially when they see price increases that go above and beyond what the true first appearances of characters are getting within those first print books. While I believe there is inherent value in true later prints whose scarcity was not a manufactured device to drive up prices, the propensity of certain websites and podcasts to continue to hype these prints is another case of the rich getting richer and will leave new collectors holding the bag.
It's very much like Mean Girls syndrome where the one girl keeps using the word 'fetch' in hopes that it will catch on. Whether it be a certain theme that an individual is into or an obscure character that they feel should be more prominent, using larger platforms which then cannibalize each other's content is in my mind market manipulation and then abuse of responsibility.

• Glad to hear it Gary. Do you mean later prints as in books like Fantasy Masterpieces and Classic X-Men? I agree that those are very different than these reprints happening months after the initial release. It's always my advice to collect what you like and never buy into the hype. Buy books that were spec'd a few months ago that have cooled off. Buy books that are going to be in museums some day. I don't think later printings are going to be those sought after pieces.
  
  If enough people say "fetch," then it'll catch on. I'm definitely not hopping into the boat.
  J

What makes you think that any group of rabid speculators or collectors act with considered logic? If COVID has taught the world anything it is that people will have a tendency to grasp on to whatever reinforces their pre-existing beliefs or desires. In the case of covers, if you are trying to make money off of them, then you will argue whatever maximizes your investment (be they speculator, publishers or LCS). On the other hand, if you are a true collector, you will have a tendency to argue the inverse as you want to minimize your cash outlay (however, that is temporary because the collector does get utility out of seeing their collection go up in value, even if they have no intention of selling).

Manufactured scarcity is not viable in the long-term, it will likely just drive collectors out of the market as the speculative drive of the 90s did, except this time instead of collectors buying multiple copies and hoarding them, speculators are buying multiple copies and flipping them. It is no different then ticket scalpers, there may be people willing to pay multiples of cover price, but the vast majority of fans either can't afford it, or refuse to pay it, and that drives people away. In the end, the speculators will leave the industry a burnt out husk as they bleed it for as much as they can before they move on to the next industry. Which is why I only collect Bronze and earlier and refuse to enter into this "red ocean".

• I completely agree, algonwolf. The current trend of artificial scarcity isn't going to hold in the long run. And it may very well crater the hobby for a decade after. I'm with you on the Bronze age books. Old stuff is only going to get older and more desirable.
  
  J

I’ve been a comic venom fan for all my life. Collecting firsts of characters has become a passion.

Here’s the truth. Store exclusives are only available if they can ship to you. Due to shipping issues, how would it be considered fair as in one being able to get the item?

When it comes to being a collector, it’s like being a Pokémon master, you gotta go on the search for stuff. But when something is over seas and your access to it is minimal due to privileges one has and one doesn’t have. That’s not fair game. This argument goes for venom 6 cover appearances as well as they are all store exclusives(and ways for them to make moneyyy)

Now when it comes to comics from the distribution, that is access to all. As long as you have a Local comic book store(LCB). And due to privileges of you economic statues, cover price makes everything fair game. Store exclusives cost money, money some do not have. Making the game unfair, but LCB and distribution marvel, they care about their fans and want to make it fair. Cause at the end of the day, comics are fun and amazing.

Now for arguments sake, venom 4 2nd print isn’t knull, it’s an avatar of knull. So it’s knull’s avatar’s first cover appearance. Not the original knull like the one on venom 3 3rd print. This knull is the real knull, as it’s a flashback of him. The OG(original).

So based on unbiased arguments and depending if you care about making rules fair for all walks of live(keeping in mind the privileges I’ve pointed out, just like there are different divisions for soccer players or any sports) venom 3 3rd print is knull’s first cover appearance.

Please keep in mind that my argument is objective and not biased because store exclusives are biased based on how they are only accessible to those with the privileges I’ve pointed out.

LCB stores are where the fair game is and it’s where distribution from the head of marvel are made. They are the ones to make the rules that make this fun experience of collecting real. If not for them, then this would all be manipulation, biased and unfair.

Venom for life and all the best to you all.

WE ARE VENOM

• Thanks for the comment, venomfan. Part of the issue is that a lot of these books aren't sold at cover price at LCSs. The argument that #3 3rd print is the "objective first" is that this isn't a widespread belief. Looking at the comments section of this post we can see the differing viewpoints on the issue that adds to the contentiousness of later printings. I think later printings are fine as investments at cover price, but hype pushes these books into the stratosphere (Thor #4 and #5) only to collapse once the hype passes. (Look at the past two months of Venom #3 3rd. It's dropped roughly $200 in FMV) The way Marvel is going to keep interest in later printings not just for reader copies but from a collector's standpoint, is to do gimmicky stuff like this. Then that puts later printings on the radar when they were not at all. Think about what this means in terms of a business model.
  
  Marvel releases a new character.
  Character is more popular than predicted.
  Marvel reprints the first comic to include now popular character on cover.
  Marvel rakes in the dough from speculators.
  
  Rinse and repeat.
  
  If speculators keep biting, Marvel and other publishers will keep pivoting later printings into "collectible issues."
  
  J

Oh here we go again... I think you'r trying to look at this in black and white, and it's just not. Every scenario is going to be different, in this case the catalyst is that #3 3rd print has the character on the cover of the issue in which the first appearance is contained making it 'cool' (after all, 'cool' is what any of this boils down to, not some arbitrary rules). Will this be the case with every new character/series, no. It's never simple black and white, these rules do not exist. The book is hot because people like it, end of story; the rest is just arguing semantics.

• The whole point of the article is that it's NOT black and white. There's clearly not a consensus on these books and my entire argument is that people shouldn't push that consensus.
  
  J

Nice article. I bought all of these at cover price (Except Frankie's-- I think it was $50 a set) so I'm good. I always thought the #4 2nd print was an avatar of Knull, and not Knull himself. There was some heat on the #4 3rd print as well. Whichever book the market decides, I'll ready.

I have all of these so doesn't really matter to me but I think the price of each actually dictates what the market has decided whether you agree or not.

• The market is still deciding.
  
  Jake